Temporary Forum support

[OberonCore]

OberonCore, you has admin rights, please do as you think it is should be.

How OberonCore must interpret this?

Ivan Denisov assigned OberonCore to be "TF admin".
OR
Ivan Denisov proposed for center members 'OberonCore to be "TF admin"' & OberonCore agree (with concrete rights and duties) & center members accept.

[Ivan Denisov]

OberonCore propose the name 'Center members' for group. Not 'BBF Community "center"'.

Let's English tongue members decide the name? "Center members" somehow qualifying the members... I am afraid to harm great developers who are not in the "center" — this is the main reason why I argue against "center" derivative names... maybe that is my mistake.

[Ivan Denisov]

OberonCore, you has admin rights, please do as you think it is should be.

How OberonCore must interpret this?

Ivan Denisov assigned OberonCore to be "TF admin".
OR
Ivan Denisov proposed for center members 'OberonCore to be "TF admin"' & OberonCore agree (with concrete rights and duties) & center members accept.

That is "TF"? I mean until we not vote for admins, please, help with a forum. Yours experience and strict views on work organisation can help to balance the chaos I have made here. But, please, do not harm people. For example, please, do not remove valexey from the group until the rules about group membership is not ready.

I want to put here the Doug letter you to remember that not only the rules rule, but also the inspiration:

Folks,

I am a little concerned by the recent tone of some messages.
The word "legal" has appeared.

Our open source development must be based on "trust".

If we go down the formal road then hours will be spent dealing
with procedural matters and little will be devoted toward maintaining
and updating BlackBox. There is nothing worse then sitting in a meeting
which starts by reading the agenda from the past meeting and then working
down the current agenda. I fall asleep in the first 5 minutes.

I request that we keep focused on the technical details and minimize procedural
concerns.

Best regards,
Doug Danforth

[ReneK]

OberonCore propose the name 'Center members' for group. Not 'BBF Community "center"'.

Would this be the temporary working name, or would this be the final official name?

Probably it's a good time to open a new discussion thread about the name of the central project group. OTOH, as long as we are not agreed on what the center does, this may be premature.

How OberonCore must interpret this?

Ivan Denisov assigned OberonCore to be "TF admin".
OR
Ivan Denisov proposed for center members 'OberonCore to be "TF admin"' & OberonCore agree (with concrete rights and duties) & center members accept.

OberonCore, again you show great restrain and wisdom in posing this question. Thank you.

Yes, I think that OberonCore definitely has great experience as a group, and we would benefit from that. OTOH, I think it is probably undue work load to not only have their own board to manage and administer, but also the blackboxframework.org boards.

Are there ways for OberonCore to do this without much effort?

Are there other center members who have the experience and the time to be board admin?

[OberonCore]

OTOH, I think it is probably undue work load to not only have their own board to manage and administer, but also the blackboxframework.org boards.

Are there ways for OberonCore to do this without much effort?

Are there other center members who have the experience and the time to be board admin?

(As any center members can see) More and more time is needed to read all posts. And many of them are out of topic. We need center members only forum (means the board in general) to write by center members only (and readable by anyone). OberonCore can create such board for blackboxframework.org as replacement of Ivan Denisov's board for blackboxframework.org and perform it's management and administration without much effort.

[ReneK]

I agree, OberonCore. The problem I see with the current forum is:

For 10 center members we currently have 17 "center members only" threads. So, instead of discussing and deciding and implementing the question "what is the center", which is paramount to know in what direction we go, the first question we have to deal with before we do anything else, we have almost double the number of threads than center members! And in most of those threads, more than one topic is discussed in a very chaotic way. I think we may now have as much as 25 topics around. With an eMail-List you automatically get all the mails, you can filter by rule into folders, if you want, and that's it. In the current scheme, you not only have to look into each thread in order to see if there is anything relevant for you in there, but you do not get them automatically into your inbox, you have to actively go to the forum. More work, more chaos for the center members, though more documentation since all that is discussed is on the 'net.

So, for those who throw one topic after the other into the pot, they think that the others are stalling progress, when in fact this inflation of topics (instead of concerted working on the most important things first) is the most important reason that things are so slow.

As you all know, I proposed to have the forum temporarily hosted by OberonCore in the first place, due to their experience and knowledge in handling a forum, and OberonCore had agreed to do this. Most of the other center members stayed silent though, and Ivan interpreted this silence as rejection of the proposition, wherefore he created this forum.

We now have the chance to have OberonCore host the temporary forum (using their expertise) AND use an international URL for this (showing that this is not a Russian-only endeavor, but an international venture).

I fully support this.

[Ivan Denisov]

OTOH, I think it is probably undue work load to not only have their own board to manage and administer, but also the blackboxframework.org boards.

Are there ways for OberonCore to do this without much effort?

Are there other center members who have the experience and the time to be board admin?

(As any center members can see) More and more time is needed to read all posts. And many of them is out of topic. We need center members only forum (means the board in general) to write by center members only (and readable by anyone). OberonCore can create such board for blackboxframework.org as replacement of Ivan Denisov's board for blackboxframework.org and perform it's management and administration without much effort.

Can't you manage this forum as administrators? There are all basic members already registered here. I am not pretending for continue administrating it if you think, that I make a mess. I am not able manage the forum by my self and I was asking for yours active inclusion in administration and moderation process from the early beginning.

[ReneK]

Can't you manage this forum as administrators? There are all basic members already registered here.

If I understand OberonCore correctly, and I may err here, the problem is:

Discussion that is relevant for center members only is spread over both boards, "center member board" and "non-center member board".

In the "non-center member board", who ever wants can add new topics, and new people can add themselves as they wish.

Sometimes, there is almost no discussion on the "center board" and lots of posts on the "Non.center board" for one and the same topic.

We can either say that
1) non-center discussion is totally irrelevant for center members discussion, until one center member introduces a topic from the non-center to the center board,
2) or we all would have to read all discussions everywhere.

I think 2) would be extremely timeconsuming.

But to do 1), we need an option to see only the unread posts of the center board on one page. Nevertheless, if I go to "view unread posts", I see ALL boards, there is no way to say "show all unread posts from center boards".

Therefore, I think OBeronCore proposed to physically/technically separate the center board from the non-center board. Also, I can imagine that if the board was hosted by OberonCore, the OberonCore admins would possibly have less work administrating or could more easily balance the work for another board on their existing server and platform, but that is probably theirs to say.